Sandra Pender (sandi.pender @t warriner.oxon.sch.uk) of Bloxham, Oxon, writes:  I have a Baptism certificate dated 1821 for my husband's G G Grandfather Joseph Lambert which states parents David & Mary Lambert. It gives location as Parish church of Ware in the county of Hertford, as on your site there is more than one church could you tell me which one this would be, and would the record office HALS have these records ? There seems to be a number of Davids and I would like to trace the correct one.

The first thing to note is that, in effect, there is only one parish church in each parish, which in the case of Ware was St Mary's.  If (as happened in some parishes) there was a separate Church of England place of worship, this would normally be considered as part of the parish church and it would (normally) use the registers of the parish church. The records held for the parish church and the many non-conformist churches, can be found on the HALS web site.

However you appear to have something more interesting - you have a baptism certificate. Unlike a post-1837 birth certificate this is not a standard document, and I would like to see a copy. Birth certificates were introduced because of the lack of documentary evidence of age (for things such as eligibility for military service, etc.) particularly for the children of non-conformists whose baptism would not be recorded in the parish register. An organisation called Dr William's Library maintained a register of births - and issued a birth certificate - and I have come across a number of these for well-to-do non-conformist families. So my first guess (without seeing the document) is that what you have is a locally produced baptismal certificate and your Joseph's parents were non-conformists.

A look for Joseph Lambert on familysearch shows that he was baptised on 2nd December 1821. However there is no entry for the parish registers, but rather the entry is qualified by the words: "Form submitted by a member of the LDS Church. The form lists the submitter's name and address and may include source information. The address may be outdated. Details vary. To find the form, you must know the batch and sheet number." The batch number is 8334330 and the sheet number is 78. The order number to view the microfilm at your nearest LDS Family History Centre is 1395681.

If you repeat the search looking for anyone called Lambert whose father is David on Batch 8334330 you find a whole family of siblings, with references on different pages on the same film. There may well be several generations of Lamberts on file. Basically someone has already researched the family and your best bet is to try and view the film (Try Family History Centre in your telephone directory - or get its address from familysearch.)

In case in may be relevant there was a David Lambert at The Cock, Amwell End, Ware, listed in the 1839 Pigot's Directory and it could be worth looking at the 1841 census to see if this is your ancestor.

Sandra replied: What I have is a copy made in1856 from the register of baptisms of the parish church of Ware in the county of Hertford. this does say 2/12/1821 for baptism. I cant quite make out his profession on this but on Joseph's marriage certificate (Norfolk) it does say David Lambert brewer so maybe the Cock at Amwell End is correct. David and Mary's marriage best way for me to proceed could you advise and thank you again for previous help.

My mistake - what you have is a Victorian extract from the register - and these are quite common - as they were used to establish age for by people who where born before civil registration, and where the was no documentary evidence of the birth. However the fact that what you have is a Victorian transcript of the parish register makes me wonder why the register entry does not appear on familysearch - and it would well be worth consulting the microfilm of the register, as the entry may be there but not indexed! This should clarify David's occupation.

I had a look at some other Trade directories: A John Lambert was listed at the Cock, Amwell End, Ware, in Pigot's 1823 and 1828/9 directory. The 1851 Post Office Directory does not mention the Cock (and it may have missed out Amwell End entirely). The 1866 edition shown a W. Davis as landlord of the Cock, Amwell End, Ware.

September, 2003

Sandra (ron.pender @t btinternet.com) updates her research: I have since been back to LDS site and from your batch no and ancestral file found two other people, one from South Africa and one from New Zealand have been researching and a whole load of Lamberts from my husband's family are there. I also made contact with a descendant from one of David's sisters From your last posting the John Lambert may well be either David's brother or father. Thanks to you I seem to be on the right track. still haven't found Mary's maiden name - really must visit HALS. Do know David's father was John Lambert and his mother Elizabeth Page and that his Grandfather was a David also married to a Mary Sutton.

December, 2005

Sandra (ron.pender @t btinternet.com) has provided further news of her research: Since I wrote last I have found Joseph's mothers name she was a Mary Ann Knight and she came from Rotherhithe in London. In 1841 he was in the Hope Inn Ware, he also owned a barge and died in 1845 and I have been lucky enough to get a copy of his will from the National Archives.  Joseph did continue in his fathers profession but his public house was in Clerkenwell and so my line left Hertfordshire.